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Question
#60376. my_baby_love
asks:
Before the modern state of Israel when was the last Jewish nation governed by Jews?
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satguru
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Unless Arpy is going to tell us of an obscure state in between (which I fully expect ;)) I have no knowledge of any between biblical times and 1948, though plans were made for states in South America and other far-flung corners, but I never learnt of any more. My late grandpa was the expert though and he could have confirmed my answer either way...
Nov 04 05, 6:21 PM
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my_baby_love
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What was the last one in Biblical times?
Nov 04 05, 9:56 PM
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daddy1161992
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I have no data to back this, but I was told that Isreal's existance is part of the apocolypse.
Nov 04 05, 10:45 PM
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miltonebx
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The Roman Empire destroyed the Temple about 69AD,renamed the country Palestine (rooted from Philistines), and the Diaspora began. Between that date and 1948, there was no Jewish State.
Nov 05 05, 7:55 AM
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tnrees
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I believe there was a state in South Arabia about the time of Mohamed
The Khazars were a Turcish tribe centred on the volga delta. The story is that they decided to convert from paganism & the khan got a rabi, an imam & a christian priest to debate among themselves who was right. Eventualy after getting no agreement he asked who was nearest to being right and the Jew got 2 votes so he converted to judaism.
The byzantines considered the Khan of the khazars to be more important than the holy Roman emperor even when the Emperor was an effective ruler.
There power was wrecked by a Russian attack (probably with Byzanitine support)about 1000. Several of the Khazars vassals then broke away 7 devastated the Russians & Byzantines.
It is believed that polish jews are not semitic but Khazar & that Khazar gave rise to Hussar.
Nov 05 05, 8:39 AM
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bloomsby
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There are various versions of all these stories and the whole area is extremely controversial. As for the last point, it was above all Arthur Koestler would took that kind of view about the historically large number of Jews in eastern Europe. However, his ideas haven't gone unchallenged, to put it mildly.
Nov 05 05, 9:01 AM
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Arpeggionist
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Bloomsby beat me to the answer. The best way to do such a thing is to pose a question late on Friday afternoons. Yes, before Israel was established as a modern state, the reign of Bar Kochva was the last attempt at Jewish self-rule here in Israel (it failed) in the second century C.E.
But between then and now, what is known about Khazaria (home of the Kuzarim, as they are known in Hebrew) is that it existed in reality. In fact, for three hundred years its kings not only were Jewish but had Hebrew names (one of the last kings of Khazaria wrote up a list of the kings in the three hundred years preceding him, among them were names like Obadiah and Pesach). Unfortunately, this was before the internet made communication easy, and the Jews didn't have their equivalent of the Christian kingdom of Prester John, which might have motivated them to cultivate a relationship with Khazaria. By the time the more knowledgable Jews in Spain learned of the existence of Khazaria, the land was about to be sacked by the Russians. At its hight, Khazaria was far more populated than modern Israel, making it the largest ever Jewish country.
There are still today some people living in the Caucas region who claim to be descended from the Kuzarim. They are all Karaites, belonging to a sect of Judaism that disregards the Talmud. They were spared the Nazi persecution in WW2 when the Nazis came to the conclusion that genetically and theologically they were not Jews. A few hundred of them still live today in and around Armenia.
Nov 05 05, 10:02 AM
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smartyshoe
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The last time was in biblical times when they owned the nation that is now Israel.
Nov 05 05, 4:46 PM
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Arpeggionist
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Depending on whether you consider the New Testament part of the Bible. To me it's post-Biblical times. The Hasmonian house (starting with Matityahu and mentioned in the book of Maccabees) was the last Jewish government and the Sanhedrin was its last legislative and judicial body.
Nov 05 05, 11:58 PM
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allofme
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I think that would be the ancient Isreal.
Nov 06 05, 4:18 PM
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