After the discovery of Pluto, did Gustav Holst ever mention any need to include it among the rest of his planets? And if not, did he ever say why not?

Gnomon

Holst wrote a Pluto movement for his Planets Suite, but it is never performed: http://www.mvdaily.com/articles/2000/05/rrpluto.htm Jun 28 06, 3:37 AM

Baloo55th

The planets of the suite were more the planets of astrology rather than those of astronomy, so far as I can recall. Pluto obviously has no effect astrologically, or they would have problems getting their charts to work. That is, assuming they do work..... Jun 28 06, 7:33 AM

Arpeggionist

Uranus and Neptune had little significance to astrologers also, but he still set them. But if he did write a Pluto movement, where can I find a score and a recording? Jun 28 06, 12:57 PM

Arpeggionist

And what was Pluto's subtitle? (If Neptune was the Mystic, Pluto should be something as well...) Jun 28 06, 1:01 PM

Baloo55th

Actually, the Pluto movement was created by Colin Matthews, who reckons that Holst never comtemplated adding Pluto. http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/entertainment/679827.stm Here's a reference to the astrological context of The Planets http://www.answers.com/topic/the-planets The sub-title of Pluto is The Renewer http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Planets I've got grave doubts about the Holst Pluto. I've never heard of it, and I would be extremely surprised if Colin Matthews wouldn't mention it if it existed. Here are the sleeve notes from the Hyperion release of the completed suite: http://www.hyperion-records.co.uk/notes/67270.html Jun 28 06, 3:43 PM

Gnomon

Both Holst and Colin Matthews wrote Pluto movements. Jun 28 06, 3:47 PM

Baloo55th

Not according to http://www.gustavholst.info/compositions/orchestra.php http://www.gustavholst.info/faq/ Is there any reference to a Holst Pluto apart from Trevor Hold's? And by the way, Hold reviewed Richard Strauss's Der Hund von die Baskervilles http://www.mvdaily.com/articles/2000/12/rrhund.htm?a amongst many others (including an opera by Brahms entitled Tom Jones!) that may have an existence - but not in the plane we live in... These 'Rejected Reviews' are very authentic sounding, but.... (Here's a link to many more of them http://shadowraider.com/videodb/trace.php?videodburl=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.mvdaily.com%2Ffun%2F Jun 28 06, 4:06 PM

Arpeggionist

Ah, but Brahms was working on several operas in the 1880s, one on the Love of Three Oranges, and another about the California gold rush. He also finished a fifth symphony (or at least got far enough with it to play it for his friends), a second violin concerto, and another Academic Festival overture. There was also an A major violin sonata at one point, apparently composed before the G major sonata was published, and which was performed several times. He might have even had a clarinet concerto in the making. I'm not making all this up - it's all well documented, but the manuscripts were probably, like many other Brahms manuscripts, destroyed by fire and water by the composer. Jun 28 06, 4:46 PM

Baloo55th

Amongst the other 'undiscovered' works reviewed are Gilbert & Sullivan's 'Billy Budd', and Chopin's 'Cantate de Noel'. One work he has missed out is Chopin's Trumpet Concerto, which I remember my mother referring to several times. Having been a pianist in her younger days, she had, of course, never actually played it.... Jun 28 06, 5:06 PM

davejacobs

The fundamental problem with reliance on websites of course, is that yu can never be sure if the informaton is correct, or is wrong out of ignorance, or wrong on purpose (a hoax), as this seems to be. I guess the lesson is never to rely on just one source, but consult as many as possible - even including real books! Jun 29 06, 1:25 AM

Baloo55th

We all fall victim to the 'Onion' Syndrome sometimes. Incidentally, the G & S Billy Budd would be a real rarity, as Melville's novel wasn't published until 1924 (well after both G & S were both dead). The inclusion of Neptune and Uranus was to replace the Sun and the Moon, as they would keep the Planet theme. Jun 29 06, 5:59 AM