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#802994 - Mon Jun 18 2012 05:05 PM Re: Tips for Authors: Time Dependency [Re: guitargoddess]
bloomsby Offline
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Agreed, absolutely!

One major problem with questions like 'Who had the most [whatevers] as of 2011?' is that even a couple of years from now some players are likely to wonder, 'Why 2011? Has this already been overtaken by events? Was there something freakish about the situation in 2011? What was the quiz author's game?'


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#811301 - Sat Jul 28 2012 02:33 PM Re: Tips for Authors: Time Dependency [Re: guitargoddess]
nautilator Offline
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Originally Posted By: guitargoddess
But then there are other things that MAY possibly become incorrect in the future, but the chance isn't great enough to be preventive about it - like how many planets are in the solar system or what the capital of a certain country is. Can change, sure, but it's likely to be safe for a fair while and we can deal with these things down the road if need ever be.

Yes, and are questions of this sort acceptable?

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#811303 - Sat Jul 28 2012 03:28 PM Re: Tips for Authors: Time Dependency [Re: nautilator]
bloomsby Offline
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Loc: Norwich England UK            
Yes, such questions are in order: nobody expects you to predict every change of knowledge. After all, there have been cases of countries that have moved their capital cities, changed the names of provinces and so on. There have even been cases of countries unexpectedly breaking up.

Please avoid:

1. Things perfectly likely to change - a point that may have been given insufficient attention in past. For example, new questions asking about the British monarch who reigned longest are not acceptable as Elizabeth II may well reign for longer than Victoria. It is a distinct possiblity.

2. Things likely to become boring and obscure in the near future. Obviously, during a drought the local water bosses have their 'fifteen minutes [or even weeks] of fame', but when the drought is over their names and comments are forgotten. The same generally applies to the minor ailments of politicians, celebrities and so on.


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#811311 - Sat Jul 28 2012 04:14 PM Re: Tips for Authors: Time Dependency [Re: bloomsby]
flopsymopsy Offline
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Originally Posted By: bloomsby
Elizabeth II may well reign for longer than Victoria. It is a distinct possiblity.


Not if she keeps jumping out of helicopters. wink



Sorry, couldn't resist. grin
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#811710 - Mon Jul 30 2012 03:14 PM Re: Tips for Authors: Time Dependency [Re: bloomsby]
nautilator Offline
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Originally Posted By: bloomsby
Yes, such questions are in order: nobody expects you to predict every change of knowledge.

And is there an official or reasonable metric like a 10-year or 20-year rule, or is it more to the discretion of the writer and editor?

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#811714 - Mon Jul 30 2012 03:38 PM Re: Tips for Authors: Time Dependency [Re: nautilator]
guitargoddess Offline


Registered: Mon Jul 09 2007
Posts: 34344
Loc: Ottawa Ontario Canada         
There's no hard and fast rule. Ultimately it would be up to the editor's discretion but as a general guideline, just try to think of how likely it is that what you're asking/saying can change at ANY time in the future (I mean, no one is really thinking about 100 years ahead, but certainly 10-20 years, yes).
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#811827 - Tue Jul 31 2012 08:12 AM Re: Tips for Authors: Time Dependency [Re: guitargoddess]
skunkee Offline
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Registered: Thu Oct 16 2003
Posts: 8970
Loc: Burlington Ontario Canada  
The likelihood of change has to be taken into account too. While the odds of discovering a new planet are slim (although it could happen), the possibility of a given celebrity divorcing and remarrying is not!


Edited by skunkee (Tue Jul 31 2012 08:21 AM)
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#1015701 - Mon Oct 14 2013 01:18 AM Time Dependency
mehaul Offline
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Registered: Wed Feb 03 2010
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Loc: Florida USA
I looked and couldn't find the thread that used to discuss the subject matter. Wasn't it a pinned one? Did it get closed?
I would like to report a quiz I encountered in a private tournament that had the following question:

10. The ____ and the ____ are two of the most disputed areas in Israel?
Your Answer: West Bank, Gaza Strip
Israel is such a disputed land, even though its such a small area. In the year 2006, the size of New York equalled a little less then seven times the size as Israel.
Question by FunTrivia.com player Nochance174

My spell check says equalled (should be equaled?) is wrong and my grammar school teaching says "its" ought to be "it's" and "... less then..." should read "... less than ..." (a common mistake). What does the size of any of the places have to do with whether they are in dispute for some reason? National borders are a political debate not a geographic one. The area here is also an ethnic and religious dispute.
As to time dependence, I don't believe the Gaza strip is disputed territory any longer. The question comes from the author's sole quiz and is a "no longer a member" status. But the quiz is listed under the author's name and should be accessible for an editor (sorry the Q had no topic) to locate and repair.
Thanx
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#1015703 - Mon Oct 14 2013 01:59 AM Re: Time Dependency [Re: mehaul]
looney_tunes Offline
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Registered: Tue Jan 20 2009
Posts: 3046
Loc: Briar Hill Victoria Australia 
It would have been more useful if you had clicked the Play This Quiz link, and could state the exact quiz from which the question comes.

I don't edit in that category, so cannot access the quiz in question, but I can state that
a) equaled and equalled are both accepted spellings of that word, depending on where you live
b) its should certainly be it's ,the contraction of it is
c) size is only pointed out, not stated as being the basis of the dispute; it is of some interest that such a small area could be the subject of such vitriolic dispute; stating that it is a small area does not in any way contradict the fact that the dispute is political, as are most disputes over regions
d) the Gaza Strip is still disputed at the end of 2013; it might be a good idea to change the question to state that these two areas are historically disputed - over the years, they have clearly been more in dispute than other areas in the same region (presumably what the incorrect options had to offer)

edited to remove a typo - '' instead of '


Edited by looney_tunes (Mon Oct 14 2013 02:33 AM)
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#1015704 - Mon Oct 14 2013 02:22 AM Re: Time Dependency [Re: mehaul]
mehaul Offline
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Registered: Wed Feb 03 2010
Posts: 5197
Loc: Florida USA
Originally Posted By: mehaul
...The question comes from the author's sole quiz ...

That ought to make finding the specific quiz easy enough.

From Wikipedia at Gaza Strip, first paragraph:
"From 2012, Gaza Strip is recognized by the UN as part of the State of Palestine..."
Wouldn't that mean it is no longer disputed territory? There are rockets fired from there and the Israeli Police intrude/impose to make arrests but those are civil disputes and not territorial. So, in 2006 the territory was in dispute but since 2012 it is no longer considered by anyone to be anything but Palestinian land.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gaza_Strip

Might I suggest (edit: much as you have) that a good correction to the question would be to frame it as a past condition? Like: "___ & ___ were once very disputed territories..." and the I/I could indicate that "As of this date, the West Bank situation has yet to be resolved."?


Edited by mehaul (Mon Oct 14 2013 02:44 AM)
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#1015811 - Mon Oct 14 2013 01:55 PM Re: Time Dependency [Re: mehaul]
kyleisalive Offline
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Registered: Mon Mar 07 2005
Posts: 5730
Loc: Toronto, Canada, eh!
Quote:
Might I suggest (edit: much as you have) that a good correction to the question would be to frame it as a past condition? Like: "___ & ___ were once very disputed territories..." and the I/I could indicate that "As of this date, the West Bank situation has yet to be resolved."?


Then that would make the question really odd for now-- the areas are still being disputed (although they also were as well, I guess), and saying something like this would be akin to saying 'The Walking Dead' was a popular TV show when its ratings are higher than they've ever been. It doesn't make sense to put it in the past tense in this way if it's in the present. This is why reworking a time-sensitive question is often difficult until you've had a few quizzes under your belt.

As for the Interesting Info there, that falls into a different trap-- time-stamping, which we also don't allow. Putting 'As of 2013 (or whatever date)' makes the question go extremely stale extremely fast as twenty years down the line, when the player takes the quiz, that date will be completely arbitrary and, in some cases (as have been seen in other quizzes), virtually irrelevant. And if something does change (ie. You say 'As of 2008, 'Futurama' is still off the air.') you fall into the possibility of it becoming extremely tacky ('Futurama' actually came back a couple years later, making that date particularly stale.)


This isn't the type of amendment we want to encourage.

You'd need to rework the question a deal more than you have to avoid the issue entirely. (ie. 'Which two areas of Israel have a history of dispute involving blah blah blah?' or 'The West Bank has been disputed by the Israeli government in the past. Which of these regions in the Middle East shares a similar history of political strife?')


Edited by kyleisalive (Mon Oct 14 2013 02:00 PM)
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#1015826 - Mon Oct 14 2013 06:09 PM Re: Time Dependency [Re: Terry]
mehaul Offline
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Registered: Wed Feb 03 2010
Posts: 5197
Loc: Florida USA
Thank you to whoever moved this from Feedback to Author Q&A.
How it is repaired is fine by me. Use any way that makes sense within the guidelines. Currently it has spelling, syntax and veracity problems that make it a poor question and that, at a minimum, makes the player stretch what is the situation to arrive at an answer.

The fact that hostilities exist between the Israelis and the Palestinians does not mean that the land is in dispute. It is rather the rest of Israel that is disputed by the Palestinians.
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