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#165838 - Sun Mar 30 2003 10:27 PM Iraq Threatens Terrorism
chelseabelle Offline
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Registered: Thu Oct 07 1999
Posts: 10282
Loc: New York USA
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March 30, 2003
Iraqis Threatening New Suicide Strikes Against U.S. Forces
By JOHN F. BURNS


BAGHDAD, Iraq, March 29 — One of Iraq's top leaders said today that Saddam Hussein's government was ready to meet the overwhelming military superiority of the United States by resorting to widespread suicide attacks against Americans and British troops "and all who support them," both inside Iraq and elsewhere in the Arab world.

Vice President Taha Yassin Ramadan, ranked No. 3 in the Iraqi hierarchy, said at a news conference that the soldier who killed four Americans in a suicide attack earlier today outside the holy city of Najaf was the first in a wave of Iraqis and other Arab volunteers ready to become "martyrs." Arabs outside Iraq, he said, should help "turn every country in the world into a battlefield."

In an hourlong display of defiance and threat, Mr. Ramadan, regarded as one of the most zealous of the men around Mr. Hussein, said there were "battalions" of Arab militants arriving in Baghdad to join the fanatical paramilitaries known here as the fedayeen, or martyrs for God. Those men, he said, were eager to follow the example of Ali Hammadi al-Namani, the Iraqi soldier posing as a taxi driver who was identified by the Baghdad government as the bomber who killed the American soldiers at Najaf.

The American forces in Iraq, Mr. Ramadan said, had "seen nothing yet," compared with what lay ahead from the Arab volunteers. "These are not suicide fighters," Mr. Ramadan said, but men following in a long tradition of martyrdom in the Islamic world. "Those who commit suicide are desperate people," he said. "They are not filled as the martyrs are with faith and confidence in the Arab nation and in their homeland."

He added: "I say to the United States administration, that it will turn the whole world into people who are willing to die for their nations. The aggressors think that their B-52's carry bombs of such weight that they are capable of killing an unlimited number of people. Should we wait until Arabs are capable of making bombs to counter that? No, all they can do is turn themselves into human bombs. If the B-52 bomber can kill 500 people at one time, I am sure that our operations by freedom fighters will be able to kill 5,000 people."

Mr. Namani, the soldier who killed the Americans, was lauded as a hero on Iraqi state television tonight. The broadcasts said Mr. Hussein, who was shown earlier meeting with top military officers, had awarded the dead man two posthumous medals.

Mr. Ramadan hinted that similar attacks were being prepared. "You will hear more good news in the coming days, he said. "The people of Iraq will receive the aggressors in the way that they should be received."

The Iraqi official implied that many of the Arab volunteers for suicide attacks had come to Baghdad from the Persian Gulf states whose governments were supporting the American-led war, and from Saudi Arabia. It was now time, he said, for the populations of those countries to support Iraq in its "decisive battle" with America, and "turn every country in the Arab world into a battlefield, not only against those who wear the military uniforms of the United States and the United Kingdom, but against all who support them."

Although overheated polemics are a feature of the Baghdad leadership, no member of the group around Mr. Hussein has ever explicitly embraced suicide attacks as a potential Iraqi weapon. Mr. Hussein announced last year that he would pay $25,000 to the family of any Palestinian suicide bomber, and rallies have been held on the West Bank to celebrate the Iraqi funds. But in its efforts to avoid a new war with the United States, the Baghdad government vehemently insisted, up to only 10 days ago, that it was not a rogue state — that it had no banned chemical, biological or chemical weapons, and no ties to terrorist groups. Today, that insistence was effectively abandoned. "Any method that stops or kills the enemy will be used," Mr. Ramadan said. http://nytimes.com
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Well, we now know they are committed to terrorism--and who knows what else.

If this sort of rhetoric really inspires widespread terrorism, in Iraq and elsewhere, there will be very difficult days ahead.

Do you think this sort of statement helps to justify the reasons for the war? I think it does.
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#165839 - Sun Mar 30 2003 11:08 PM Re: Iraq Threatens Terrorism
Copago Offline
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Registered: Tue May 15 2001
Posts: 14384
Loc: Australia
On our news this morning they said that there are 4,000 people 'signed up' to be suicide bombers.

Scary stuff.

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#165840 - Sun Mar 30 2003 11:08 PM Re: Iraq Threatens Terrorism
damnsuicidalroos Offline
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Registered: Mon Feb 10 2003
Posts: 2167
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NSW Australia
I just don`t see how the word terrorism can be applied to military actions within the area of that conflict.Sure if there were actions of deliberate killings of coalition civilians outside the sphere of fighting I would class it as terrorism,like the wtc and suicide bombings,but this is now war.If the term terrorist is applied to Iraqis fighting the coalition forces in civilian clothes does this now mean that every spy is now a terrorist?If in the course of this war a coalition soldier infiltrates an Iraqi military complex by wearing civilian clothes and blows the complex up is he now considered a terrorist?Of course the Iraqis are going to use whatever means at their disposal to fight us in their own country,just as I`m sure anyone from a western country would do.Once again I find myself in the position of the devils advocate and I`m not overjoyed at it!God maybe its a question of semantics but i cannot call anyone fighting in their country a terrorist.Whatever happened to the word "guerrilla"?....Websters Dictionary:Any member of a small defensive force of irregular soldiers,usually volunteers,making surprise raids against supply lines,etc.behind the lines of an invading enemy army.


Edited by damnsuicidalroos (Sun Mar 30 2003 11:18 PM)
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#165841 - Sun Mar 30 2003 11:37 PM Re: Iraq Threatens Terrorism
Kuu Offline
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Registered: Mon Jun 03 2002
Posts: 1037
Loc: Hobart Tasmania Australia     
^^ I agree.

During WWII the French Underground were labelled 'Freedom Fighters' not terrorists. The Iraqis only have a limited ways to fight back. One of those is to go in among enemy soldiers and detonate a bomb. If it is an act aimed at enemy soldiers it isn't a terorist act.

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#165842 - Sun Mar 30 2003 11:47 PM Re: Iraq Threatens Terrorism
chelseabelle Offline
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Registered: Thu Oct 07 1999
Posts: 10282
Loc: New York USA
I think you are overlooking some of the things the man was saying--which go beyond Iraq defending itself. Consider this comment:

"It was now time, he said, for the populations of those countries to support Iraq in its "decisive battle" with America, and "turn every country in the Arab world into a battlefield, not only against those who wear the military uniforms of the United States and the United Kingdom, but against all who support them."

When you talk about turning every Arab country into a battlefield, and attacking all those who support the U.S. and the U.K., it seems to me we are discussing terrorists and not freedom fighters.

He is also implicitly threatening to use weapons of mass destruction--the ones they said they didn't have.
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#165843 - Sun Mar 30 2003 11:57 PM Re: Iraq Threatens Terrorism
damnsuicidalroos Offline
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Registered: Mon Feb 10 2003
Posts: 2167
Loc: Sydney
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Yes CB i did overlook some of his comments but I was really only moved to post after i read your second last line.Perhaps I read it the wrong way but to me it did drift towards calling military actions "in Iraq" terrorism.My error?You were indicating that it inspired people "in Iraq" to commit acts of terrorism elsewhere?
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#165844 - Mon Mar 31 2003 05:04 AM Re: Iraq Threatens Terrorism
snm Offline
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Registered: Thu Jan 30 2003
Posts: 901
Loc: Israel
Well, yesterday's suicide bombing over here was carried out by a terrorist who left a videotaped message in which he claimed that he was carrying out the attack "for the Iraqis". His terrorist friends changed the name of their "team" and named themselves after the Najaf suicide bomber.
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#165845 - Mon Mar 31 2003 05:14 AM Re: Iraq Threatens Terrorism
snm Offline
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Registered: Thu Jan 30 2003
Posts: 901
Loc: Israel
Quote:

I just don`t see how the word terrorism can be applied to military actions within the area of that conflict.




One of the accepted definitions of terrorism is an action which is carried out for the purpose of becoming a martyr (among other things). That would seem to apply here, no matter where the attacks take place.

Personally, I really don't see how the words "military actions" can be applied to suicide bombings.
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#165846 - Mon Mar 31 2003 07:40 AM Re: Iraq Threatens Terrorism
chelseabelle Offline
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Registered: Thu Oct 07 1999
Posts: 10282
Loc: New York USA
Roos, you are right, I was a little unclear because I combined Iraq with the rest of the Arab world in that sentence. I'm not sure I would use the world terrorism either to describe any defensive actions within Iraq.

But Mr Ramadan is not just talking about Iraq's tactics in terms of defense, he is also calling for a holy war throughout the Arab world directed at the U.S., the U.K., and everyone who supports them. He is clearly advocating mass terrorist attacks throughout the Arab world. A call which elicited an immediate response from Islamic Jihad.

And, when he says the Iraqis will use "any method that stops and kills the enemy", it can be inferred that that would include WMD.

I do think this sort of rhetoric tends to confirm the reasons given by Bush for fighting this war.
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