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#819777 - Thu Aug 30 2012 04:51 AM Geographical slant on questions
english_gent Offline
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Registered: Thu Apr 30 2009
Posts: 24
Loc: Dartmouth Devon England UK
I've noticed, as I'm sure many others have too, the slant (sometimes heavy bias) towards american subjects.

I appreciate that it possible that the majority of people venturing onto this site, and submitting questions, are indeed american located or of american origins.

However, as a suggestion, would it not be possible to perhaps tag each question with a geographical reference and maybe limit a set of random questions (for the daily or hourly question sets) with five from any geographical location??

Is this a viable option to do??

Would this be appreciated by the masses??

Just wanted to throw this idea out into the ether and see if
a) my arm gets bitten off;
b) if this has been thought off before;
d) yes, there is no c; and
e) what others thing of this bias.

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#819804 - Thu Aug 30 2012 06:19 AM Re: "Americacentricity" of quizzes [Re: tezza1551]
english_gent Offline
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Registered: Thu Apr 30 2009
Posts: 24
Loc: Dartmouth Devon England UK
I just want to add my voice to this thread.

Had many examples of bias towards american related questions and just taken Who's The Expert and of 15 questions, 14 of which were american.

Now, I understand that the majority of people here may well be american, or ask american related questions - thats to be expected. However, this IS the internet and as such, it has to be recognised that people use this site ALL over the world.

My suggestion for reducing any slant/bias towards any one geographical area is to simply add a field when submitting questions to determine said geographical area (say by USA/UK/Canada/Australia/Europe etc) and then limit any question set to no more than 5 from any area.

Whether this is pratical or not is another matter and only can be addressed by those in the know. I'm guessing that for future submitted questions, it wouldn't be a problem, but for those already submitted than this could be a lengthy process.

I admit to not having read through the whole thread here, (and will rectify after posting this) but I personally feel that for this site to be fully 'international' it needs to have more questions set (by people of this site) to compensate for the american subject matter.

I do understand that whilst the site may have started off small and grown over the years, retrospective action to counter bias is never going to be easy, but there needs to be some adjustment to make it a more level playing field for all concerned.
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#819852 - Thu Aug 30 2012 10:14 AM Re: "Americacentricity" of quizzes [Re: english_gent]
reeshy Offline
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Registered: Tue Aug 11 2009
Posts: 741
Loc: Glasgow Scotland UK           
The advice that is nearly always given when a question of US bias comes up still applies: the reason so many questions have a US slant is because most members are American. If you want to increase the number of questions from other countries, then you can always have a go at writing them yourselves.
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#819875 - Thu Aug 30 2012 10:52 AM Re: "Americacentricity" of quizzes [Re: reeshy]
dsimpy Offline
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Registered: Sun Jan 24 2010
Posts: 466
Loc: Belfast Ireland
I actually think this issue of the 'America-centricity' of questions on Funtrivia can be a little overstated. There's no doubt there are 'more' American questions than from other English-speaking countries, and that's clearly unavoidable given the site membership, but I don't think the imbalance is as bad as that.

To be honest, most of us outside the USA are so bombarded with multiple aspects of American culture in our daily lives - television, KFC/McDonalds, Hollywood etc. etc. - that we're way more familiar with 'American' trivia questions than many US-based players are with British-Irish-Australian (and even Canadian?) trivia questions ... so that reduces the effect of any imbalance considerably.

So I honestly don't think it's a problem on Funtrivia ... apart perhaps from the obsession 'some' US question writers have for incomprehensible football/baseball statistics wink ... and the other tendency to assume that only Americans are reading their question and that there's no need therefore to make clear it relates to things-American! The example that comes to mind are questions like "Who was the first President to ...", as though no other country in the world has Presidents! laugh

... Apart from that, no problem crazy
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#819883 - Thu Aug 30 2012 11:05 AM Re: "Americacentricity" of quizzes [Re: dsimpy]
JanIQ Offline
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Registered: Thu Jul 09 2009
Posts: 592
Loc: Antwerp<br>Belgium
I'm afraid english_gent's suggestion is not quite practicable.
Terry could program a box for indicating on *new* questions / quizzes which region is involved. But who'll take care of the more than a million existing questions?
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#819888 - Thu Aug 30 2012 11:39 AM Re: "Americacentricity" of quizzes [Re: dsimpy]
AdamM7 Offline
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Registered: Sat Feb 18 2012
Posts: 531
Loc: Cheshire England UK           
Originally Posted By: dsimpy
and the other tendency to assume that only Americans are reading their question and that there's no need therefore to make clear it relates to things-American! The example that comes to mind are questions like "Who was the first President to ...", as though no other country in the world has Presidents! laugh


I'm sure this isn't just with American questions. Out of a lot more than 1,000,000 questions on the site, I'm sure at least one of them asks "Who was our prime minister in 1912?", or "When did we last win a medal in the Olympics?" It might seem like this because there are more American questions, so more act like this is a purely American site. Either that or the fact that most questions from the point of view of an Italian would not be accepted, even with the lower standards that this site used to have.
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#819890 - Thu Aug 30 2012 12:01 PM Re: "Americacentricity" of quizzes [Re: AdamM7]
dsimpy Offline
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Registered: Sun Jan 24 2010
Posts: 466
Loc: Belfast Ireland
Originally Posted By: AdamM7


I'm sure this isn't just with American questions. Out of a lot more than 1,000,000 questions on the site, I'm sure at least one of them asks "Who was our prime minister in 1912?", or "When did we last win a medal in the Olympics?"


Hmmm yes, I'll concede that .... at least one question out of a million!! I think my point though, that there is a reasonably significant MINORITY of American questions (FAR higher than one in a million and FAR more frequently than is the case for questions written by players of other countries) that don't bother specifying the specific context - the USA - that they refer to, still holds true.
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#819923 - Thu Aug 30 2012 03:16 PM Re: "Americacentricity" of quizzes [Re: dsimpy]
english_gent Offline
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Registered: Thu Apr 30 2009
Posts: 24
Loc: Dartmouth Devon England UK
I see that some of the posters who followed my post, if they're specifically replying to my post, didn't fully understand my drift.

It has to be accepted that the majority of the questions already submitted are american related in subject, and one remedy to this is simply for more questions to be submitted which are NOT american related. Difficult possibly as the sphere of 'americanism' is expanding if you consider TV programmes (as an example) are now shown more and more thoughout the world.

However, to simply brush this over as 'this is how it is' is simply a poor (and lazy) excuse and while I accept that to retrospectively alter submitted questions to fit in with the idea that I proposed (as an example) will take a lot of time, I feel that there should be at least some effort made to 'level the playing field'.

Fine if all people want to do is answer questions on a specific theme/subject, but when attempting to complete general hourly/daily quizzes and to be stumped by a influx of american-based questions seems somewhat unfair to those people who are in the minority (namely - non-american individuals).

The internet is a region-free zone where impartiality should reign supreme, and whilst I appreciate that this objective is a long term goal, it should be something (for everyone, both admin and quizwriters) to aim for and there's no time like the present to address this issue.

To ignore this imbalance is to accept that that there is a 'class difference' with America being in heirachy position over the rest of the quizzing world.
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#819924 - Thu Aug 30 2012 04:04 PM Re: "Americacentricity" of quizzes [Re: english_gent]
sue943 Offline

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Posts: 35963
Loc: Jersey Channel Islands        
As our members write all the quizzes and the majority of our members are American how can you insist that they write quizzes aimed at Brits or Aussies? It would be the same as insisting that you write an American quiz when you are British.
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#819926 - Thu Aug 30 2012 04:05 PM Re: "Americacentricity" of quizzes [Re: english_gent]
looney_tunes Offline
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Registered: Tue Jan 20 2009
Posts: 3290
Loc: Briar Hill Victoria Australia 
There are two separate issues here - questions that have an unwritten assumption that players will know they are referring to the United States, and the number of quizzes that are based on US trivia.

The questions you see are the ones written by FunTrivia members and placed online because they met the standards at the time they were written. If you feel a change needs to be made to a question to make it more accessible in the timed games, you should submit a correction note after playing it. The volunteer editors have their hands full editing new quizzes and attending to corrections that have been sent - there is no way anyone has time to go through 120,000 quizzes searching for questions that could be reoworded to be more precise. (I personally cringe a little bit every time I see Civil War references, as if there was only one civil war in the history of the world. However, since the category in which the quiz is found specifies American history, it is fair for the writer to assume that players will expect the questions to be about the US civil war of the 19th century.)

As others have said before, both on this topic and in other threads bemoaning the fact that many of the quizzes in a certain category seem to be on a single topic rather than the full scope that the category offers, the only way to increase the number of questions that focus on a particular area is to be part of the quiz writing process, and increase the number of quizzes that do not focus on the United States.
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#819942 - Thu Aug 30 2012 04:42 PM Re: "Americacentricity" of quizzes [Re: english_gent]
dsimpy Offline
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Registered: Sun Jan 24 2010
Posts: 466
Loc: Belfast Ireland
Originally Posted By: english_gent


The internet is a region-free zone where impartiality should reign supreme, and whilst I appreciate that this objective is a long term goal, it should be something (for everyone, both admin and quizwriters) to aim for and there's no time like the present to address this issue.



No time like the present indeed! smilee In your six and a half years on the site so far, you've written 11 questions and no quizzes. It'd be great to see some quintessentially English quizzes from you to level the playing field a bit against those damn yanks! wink
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#819953 - Thu Aug 30 2012 05:36 PM Re: "Americacentricity" of quizzes [Re: dsimpy]
lesley153 Offline
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Registered: Fri Sep 07 2007
Posts: 725
Loc: Bedford England UK           
I agree with english_gent that it would be really rather nice to know, before we commit ourselves to a quiz, whether or not an ostensibly global title genuinely is global, or contains 100% American topics.

I didn't realise that we were competing with each other over who's written more or most quizzes, or that we need to have written a minimum number of quizzes to be entitled to an opinion.
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#819959 - Thu Aug 30 2012 06:34 PM Re: "Americacentricity" of quizzes [Re: english_gent]
guitargoddess Online   FT-cool
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Registered: Mon Jul 09 2007
Posts: 35157
Loc: Ottawa Ontario Canada         
Originally Posted By: english_gent

The internet is a region-free zone where impartiality should reign supreme, and whilst I appreciate that this objective is a long term goal, it should be something (for everyone, both admin and quizwriters) to aim for and there's no time like the present to address this issue.

To ignore this imbalance is to accept that that there is a 'class difference' with America being in heirachy position over the rest of the quizzing world.



But this particular website is American-owned. There is absolutely no requirement to make the site's features 'fair' for people from other countries. By your criteria, should we be expected to offer quizzes and games entirely in multiple world languages, because otherwise it's biased against people who don't have a firm grasp of English? This site has a great number of things to do here, some of which are more 'fair' or widely accessible to international members than others.

I think there is already a lot in place to try to make things as fair as possible: many categories disallow certain types of questions because the answers can differ around the world (e.g. movie release dates), we enforce that questions be worded as clearly possible if there may be international confusion (if you see questions that are truly ambiguous and may have different answer depending on what region you think of, it's probably an old question; flag it for editor attention), and people from any country are allowed to join and submit material.

But at the end of the day, it's an American website and the content is largely American. That's not unfair. It'd be like if you repeatedly went to an Indian restaurant and kept complaining that there was too much Indian food. You're free to choose not too participate in whichever of the games or subjects if you are frustrated that you don't know enough answers.
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#819965 - Thu Aug 30 2012 06:57 PM Re: "Americacentricity" of quizzes [Re: guitargoddess]
agony Offline

Administrator

Registered: Sat Mar 29 2003
Posts: 11971
Loc: Western Canada
Flagging questions according to the supposed bias of whatever country would also not necessarily meet the needs of players.

I am Canadian. I have zero interest in playing Canadian-slanted questions - I want a variety, with many having no bias to country of any sort (Science, animals, workdplay...) I listen to music from all over the world, read books from all over the world, have a reasonable grasp of history of the western world, at any rate, and would like to learn more about the rest of the world. Ditto Geography, Movies, People...

Authors already complain about how stringent our quiz and question writing rules are. Should we add to them the rule that authors also categorize whether a question is a) very specific to the US, Canada, the UK, Australia, etc etc, b) moderately specific to blah blah, c) slightly specific to etc etc, d) non specific as to region? And then players would have to choose which question pool they would have their questions drawn from, keeping in mind that in certain subjects the pool would be very small and the questions memorized in a very short time.

So, no, I'm sorry, I think that the suggestion is not really very practical, even leaving aside the enormous task of categorizing all existing questions.

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#819991 - Thu Aug 30 2012 09:16 PM Re: "Americacentricity" of quizzes [Re: agony]
zorba_scank Offline
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Registered: Tue Feb 20 2007
Posts: 1852
Loc: Mumbai India
I agree with Agony on this. I'm from India and most of the questions on the site about my country or the Indian subcontinent are on topics I'm already well versed with. I come here to learn about other parts of the world and things that are not familiar to people like me. If the hourly games were tailored to give me questions only from my region, given the small question pool, it would soon turn out to be a memory game of 'fastest fingers first' with nothing new for me to learn. Of course this wouldn't work at all for categories like Movies, Music, TV etc. where I doubt there are more than a couple of India specific quizzes. It would be even worse for me if it was broadened to include Asia. I'm more likely to have heard of American/British TV shows, than something being shown in China.
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#820024 - Fri Aug 31 2012 02:00 AM Re: "Americacentricity" of quizzes [Re: zorba_scank]
english_gent Offline
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Registered: Thu Apr 30 2009
Posts: 24
Loc: Dartmouth Devon England UK
Firstly, thanks dsimpy for taking the time to point out the length of time that I've been on the site.

But actually I've only ever been on here for 9 months at best in that whole period so that information is somewhat skewed but thanks for attempting to put a point accross :p.

I have actually recently submitted several QQ questions in my paltry attempt to address this issue but I am merely one voice in the wilderness. Let's not speak of attempts to submit a full quiz - thats another issue for another day.

I fully understand other peoples points and the suggestion I made was only a suggestion. I fully accept that even if if was a good idea, to geographically catalogue all previously submitted questions is a huge problem.

Yes, this site is an american based one, but when the site is on the internet, the 'home' location becomes meaningless, and especially when one pays for membership, then surely one is allowed to post his/her suggestions and opinions???

The quote "the customer is king" is valid in most businesses and as this site offers membership, then desite whatever reasons that brought it about, to ensure the growth of the site, opinions surely matter.

Now, if this idea of my is rubbish then fair do. But once again, it doesn't remove the fact that for some people (either majority or minority) some displeasure has been raised about the amount of american related questions appearing in the hourly/daily quizzes and no matter how you look at it, presents an unfair quiz for those who are not american.

There will be no easy answer in getting this addressed other than to take the easy way out and say 'if it ain't broke, don't fix it'.

I know it may come accross as whinging/moaning/complaining but having said that, being an english speaking person, I am lucky that the site is in english. Pity the poor lads/lasses however who speak little english and still wish to participate on this site - it must be a hundred times worse for them.
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#820035 - Fri Aug 31 2012 04:16 AM Re: "Americacentricity" of quizzes [Re: english_gent]
dsimpy Offline
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Registered: Sun Jan 24 2010
Posts: 466
Loc: Belfast Ireland
Well english_gent, I've never suggested anywhere you're not entitled to an opinion - of course you are! So am I.

My opinion is that there simply isn't a problem of over-Americanization of questions in the mixed games. I accept that some other non-Americans feel as you do, however many non-Americans (as I know from previous discussion of this issue in the Forums) do not.

I also like rising to the challenges the site throws up (including stuff that baffles me), instead of expecting the site to be continuously tweaked to cater for one preference or another.

What we all agree on is that the most effective way to address any perceived imbalance is for non-American players to contribute questions and quizzes on their own culture and social context.

I don't think your own proposal is workable at all, not least - as I think someone else has said - because it would involve pretty subjective judgements being made about the 'degree of Americanicity' or 'degree of Britishness' or ... of any question.

Incidentally, a lot of question/quiz writers don't only write questions based on their own geographic context. Although Irish, I've written American, Australian, Canadian, Scottish, English, French (etc) questions, and I know loads of other players have gone outside their own 'zone' too.


Edited by dsimpy (Fri Aug 31 2012 04:18 AM)
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#820036 - Fri Aug 31 2012 04:20 AM Re: "Americacentricity" of quizzes [Re: english_gent]
sisterseagull Offline
Forum Adept

Registered: Tue Aug 16 2011
Posts: 199
Loc: Torquay Devon England UK      
Well.... I'm trying to do my bit!

I have twenty-one single questions accepted on a variety of subjects, mainly british military history, but also including Sweden and France, so there's a european slant there (I have another thirty or forty in the pipeline also).

I have thirteen full quizzes on line, again eleven of these are typically british and the remaining two are about France, with a further eight in various stages of construction... I am working on a list of subjects that I also would like to write quizzes about and these number around twenty. Like the Americans here, I like to write questions and quizzes about subjects that interest me and that I have a good working knowledge of. Most of my quizzes and questions are pretty obscure (at least I think so) but I also try to be mindful of the fact that some of my players will not have english as their first language but, with a little research the answers are not that difficult to find... I have one quiz that is about the local dialect in my part of England, its only had 120 plays so far, so certainly not american!

It's great to learn things about different parts of the world so there'll be no complaints from me on that score. FunTrivia (even with the american bias) is worth every penny/cent/euro/yen etc of my membership fee!

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#820043 - Fri Aug 31 2012 05:23 AM Re: "Americacentricity" of quizzes [Re: sisterseagull]
english_gent Offline
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Registered: Thu Apr 30 2009
Posts: 24
Loc: Dartmouth Devon England UK
I'm also getting a list of questions built up ready to submit (both QQ and full quizzes) and whilst I agree to learning about other parts of the world, it is darn annoying to do an hourly/daily quiz and get shed loads of american questions (for the most part generally unknown to those not living in the USA) especially when one is trying to obtain a badge or two.

So, it seems to be accept the status quo and try to change from within. Hey ho.

And dsimpy, I wasn't having a go at the 'free speech'/opinion part, was just 'correcting' the point about the actual time I've been on here.

@ sisterseagull - a fellow devon living soul smile I will have to venture your way and see your quizzes.

Well, thats my thoughts said on this subject.

Enjoy the quizzes, american or otherwise :p lol smile
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#820108 - Fri Aug 31 2012 07:25 AM Re: "Americacentricity" of quizzes [Re: english_gent]
Midget40 Offline
Forum Champion

Registered: Mon Oct 27 2008
Posts: 5056
Loc: Perth Western Australia       
Every time this topic comes up the whole 'well write more questions that aren't American' comes up.

This is just ridiculous.

If there are lots more Americans on the site the questions/quizzes now are going to far outweigh the non- American ones so even the NEW question pool is going to be US biased.

And it's not just a matter of trying to match them now - you have to try and increase the number to outweigh all the old ones that are on here which is virtually impossible.

It's not going to happen from a purely logical/mathematical angle so lets stop trying to pretend that it's the answer to the problem.

I don't think there is an answer to this problem (and it obviously IS a problem for a lot of people) so lets just admit that there isn't a way to fix it instead of bringing this old chestnut up every time

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#820112 - Fri Aug 31 2012 07:55 AM Re: "Americacentricity" of quizzes [Re: Midget40]
tezza1551 Offline
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Registered: Tue Feb 05 2008
Posts: 439
Loc: Western Australia
Well said, Midget40.
but what else would you expect from another West Aussie !
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#820126 - Fri Aug 31 2012 08:31 AM Re: "Americacentricity" of quizzes [Re: tezza1551]
agony Offline

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Registered: Sat Mar 29 2003
Posts: 11971
Loc: Western Canada
Another approach to this - and honestly, it's not meant to be in any way dismissive - is not to play the games where this bias bothers you. There is no obligation in any way to play the dailies and hourlies.

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#820132 - Fri Aug 31 2012 08:55 AM Re: "Americacentricity" of quizzes [Re: agony]
rossian Online   content
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Registered: Sat Jun 10 2006
Posts: 1724
Loc: Merseyside UK 
I mostly find the balance of questions works out. In KO, or the Daily Game, there is usually one US sport or geography question which I struggle with but often balanced out by a UK question which I know, but would probably cause more difficulty to an American player. This doesn't always happen, but occurs often enough for me to think that Terry has tried to build this in to the database selection.

Getting the balance right isn't easy. I've written several UK specific quizzes and also mixtures. Even then some players complain. I've had notes saying that the player doesn't like UK and US hits being covered in the same quiz, or complaining that a quiz should have been labelled 'UK specific' because of one, very small, reference.
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#820143 - Fri Aug 31 2012 10:22 AM Re: "Americacentricity" of quizzes [Re: Kuu]
ga_jam831 Offline
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Registered: Thu May 26 2011
Posts: 456
Loc: Warner Robins Georgia USA     
Originally Posted By: Kuu
I could do a quiz on something like South American Pioneer Aviation (a subject I am actually interested in) but I doubt anyone much would do it. Likewise on many other subjects I am interested in.


I would tell my Dad about this quiz if you wrote it. He has been flying most of his life so I know he would find it interesting. I say go for it!
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#820151 - Fri Aug 31 2012 01:23 PM Re: "Americacentricity" of quizzes [Re: ga_jam831]
reeshy Offline
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Registered: Tue Aug 11 2009
Posts: 741
Loc: Glasgow Scotland UK           
I doubt that any one who suggests the writing of more non-US questions seriously imagines that non-US will one day beat out US questions. I certainly didn't when I reiterated the suggestion. Actually, writing more questions from other countries DOES contribute to the solution, in my opinion, as it enriches the variety of the question pool and there will be more non-US questions than otherwise. I dare say that in any case it's a much better solution than if anyone were to suggest cutting down on the US questions! I agree with the suggestion to play other games if you're bothered about the bias - there are plenty of country-specific quizzes out there. Otherwise, you just have to play the hourlies etc. with the caveat that questions MAY be more US-based. I say "may" because I honestly don't notice that I'm being bombarded with US questions all the time. Of course there is no quick fix, and possibly not a proper solution at all, but pooh-poohing suggestions to expand the variety of questions is certainly not going to help either. Although the internet is international, it must be borne in mind that most authors ARE American, and many people are much more comfortable writing what they know. The questions are made up of what the community submits, so if there's an imbalance, it needs to be addressed by the community, i.e. the authors, but certainly without the restriction on people submitting US-based questions: there has to be an increase instead of questions based on other countries.

Just my (perhaps a bit more than!) two cents.


Edited by reeshy (Fri Aug 31 2012 01:25 PM)
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