Moral Maze is a BBC radio programme where moral or ethical issues surrounding a current event are discussed and debated in a non-inflammatory manner, usually taking the form of a number of witnesses appearing for and against the motion, and a panel that cross-examines them and sometimes deliberates.

It is in this manner that I would be interested in hearing other people's views and arguments about how we should be tackling the current threat of terrorism and extremism that its perpetrators claim - claim!- is done in the name of Islam.

I hope a discussion under the moral maze banner can avoid offence and controversy (and insults or high horses) that sometimes get these discussions closed on this board. We have an intelligent and varied group of people here, and restrained debate could be so enlightening.

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Today, in the UK, some offence has been taken over a letter sent from the government to British mosques. The letter asks the leaders of mosques and communities to take on the job of explaining to their congregations, and in particular their younger generations, what it means to be a British Muslim.

You can read the original letter on the link to a pdf embedded in this article : http://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2015/...-muslim-leaders


My first reaction is that it was a very acceptable request and a necessary request! (But if I was Muslim, maybe I would find it a patronising and ignorant letter??)

Was the government right to engage with mosques in this manner?

Hoo boy, I can never resist a can of worms lol.

I personally think that sending a letter to mosques is ridiculous. It's sort of like shutting the barn door after the horse has left.

And I do think that if I was a Muslim (which I'm not) I would take a least a little offense to the vague "accusation" that my entire culture was somehow to blame. True Muslims would not participate in terrorism. That's not what Muhammed via Allah preaches

There are plenty of folk from other religions/cultures who do despicable things. Did they get letters too? lol

Worms are great! Let them wriggle, I say.


"... shutting the barn door after the horse has left...."

That could imply that the problem is over and done with but of course it is not. It is an ongoing problem. Countries are finding that their terrorists are "homegrown", not imported, and yet the acts are done against activities (such as freedom of expression) that are vital to the identity of the countries in question. Where once we might have estimated or wondered if there was a schism happening in our own streets, now we know beyond doubt that there is, and whereas we also know that most people find ways to handle the differences of belief in a peaceful way, we also know that some people are choosing to handle it in a violent way. I don't know how else to solve the problem but to go to the heart of the communities most affected and to say 'let's all work together, from the same song sheet, with the same aims'.

"And I do think that if I was a Muslim (which I'm not) I would take a least a little offense to the vague "accusation" that my entire culture was somehow to blame."

I must admit, I imagine I might bristle a bit at it too. But isn't the point of communicating clearly like this, however awkward or bristly it might make people feel, that there is a much bigger, much more important issue at hand that has been allowed to get out of hand because no one wanted to make anyone feel bristly. Now is not the time to bristle.



"True Muslims would not participate in terrorism. That's not what Muhammed via Allah preaches"


I think the letter acknowledged this. What it is asking is that the mosques make sure that no one is interfering with this message, because someone is interfering! The leaders who take offence at this request are blaming the internet, and that is a fair point, but who should condemn the ramblings on the internet? If I condemn them, what will my voice mean to a young Muslim man? I imagine it will mean nothing at all...but his mosque might carry more weight?


"There are plenty of folk from other religions/cultures who do despicable things. Did they get letters too?"

I don't know that there really are fair comparisons. I can't think of any - at least, I can't think of anything that hasn't been definitively addressed by leaders of religions. (In the UK. Out of the UK, I am all for following suit and sending letters to all sorts of people :D).

lol, I hear ya. But sorry, I didn't get the letter so I don't know what it said.

The "shutting the barn door" comment was not meant to imply that that the problem has been solved, but rather that someone should have thought of the consequences before they opened the door in the first place

As for current folks who might get letters? Probably not many. But historically, one might think of the Holocaust, or the KKK, or the Crusades, ad nauseum.

I have no immediate solutions, but many countries in the world might want to revisit their immigration policies, as well as the staff running the depts. It's one "commissioned investigation" I might actually be willing to support with taxpayer dollars lol.

Perhaps it was my juvenile nature coming out and my ignorance of British politics as an American, but I couldn't help but laugh every time the politician named Mr. Pickles was named in that article.

In all seriousness, I find the letter condescending. The intent was perhaps aimed in the right direction, but the delivery was terrible. A letter from the government is like the note that you get from your teacher to go home to your parents--however carefully worded, it still stings.

If the politicians really wanted to foster a relationship, they ought to meet personally with the religious leaders and have discussions, not just send them letters. "But there were 1000 letters they sent out!" one might think. Exactly. If you wish to make inroads with any community, it is with personal outreach and a friendly face, not a letter, which reeks of government bureaucracy and only gives you the appearance of doing something while not actually doing something. It might seem a difficult task to meet with 1000 different religious leaders, but trying to defeat extremism makes it seem a small task indeed.

I don't know about Mr. Pickles' other efforts at outreach, but this one struck me as particularly lazy and self-serving. If he is striving to meet with these religious leaders in person and explains his position in person, then I believe his intent will truly be genuine. But the letter, nah.

Edited for typo.

I agree Trident

Nothing more cowardly than an officious letter.

I think it may be an old English tradition to solve everything with a "stiffly worded letter" .

I don't quite see the cowardly part. Cowardly to say your piece and run, you mean?

I'm not sure I see the point, except to give the appearance of "doing something." The only people a message like that will reach are people who already agree with it, and those people are surely conscious of how resistant the issue is to easy fixes. More generally, you don't change people's minds by appealing to abstractions; you change them by approaching them in terms they can accept, giving them vivid, relatable evidence that they can tangibly benefit by behaving differently, and letting them figure out for themselves what to do next.

Ssending out letters to people who had nothing to do with the extremism is not something that happens when Christian terrorists are involved, from Scott Roeder to the Lord's Resistance Army to that whole Northern Ireland thing. I'd love for religious violence to completely disappear (all of it, and there's only one way that's gonna happen) but in the meantime, the difference in standards is pretty obvious.

Cowardly because as halekotsi said it's nothing more than the APPEARANCE of doing something. There's nothing personal about it, no human contact, waste of time and typing of the memo. Preaching to the choir has never solved anything, in fact it's probably made previous fence sitters make a choice, which might not be a good thing.

Sending letters to students about violence and bullying and carrying arms won't stop shootings either. Good people don't need to be told what to do and bad people won't listen (or read). And frankly the latter are more likely to do something bad because they were told NOT to. I can see such a letter riddled with bullets already, sigh.