I don't know if this has ever been addressed (I could not find a forum post on it), but I believe ending punctuation regarding quotation marks is incorrect on most FT quizzes.

I was taught and believed that commas and periods go inside quotations marks.
For example: Last year I saw the movie "Jaws."
And not: Last year I saw the movie "Jaws".

To my understanding, the main exception to this is where including the punctuation mark inside the quoted material would change the nature or substance of the quoted material (e.g., questions marks).
For example: Have you seen the new musical "Hamilton"?
And not: Have you seen the new musical "Hamilton?"

See http://www.grammarbook.com/punctuation/quotes.asp
"Rule 4. Periods and commas ALWAYS go inside quotation marks."
"Rule 5a. The placement of question marks with quotation marks follows logic. If a question is within the quoted material, a question mark should be placed inside the quotation marks."

I know it's not the end of the world, but I think most quizzes here have it wrong. Agree or disagree?

British and American styles differ, and British usage demands that periods be outside the quotation marks unless it is part of the quote.

Since we allow both versions of English, we allow both versions of punctuation styles.

http://www.thepunctuationguide.com/british-versus-american-style.html

In addition, where the quotation marks are being used to replace italics, not to indicate a quotation, it is more appropriate to place the punctuation outside the quotation mark. You would not italicise the punctuation if writing the titles in italics.

In addition, one of the style books (I don't remember which one) mentions "house rules". While one publication may want punctuation marks inside quote marks, another may want them outside. I was taught to put them inside but I noticed most quizzes here had them outside, so that's the way I do mine now.

I'm American and was taught punctuation goes inside the quotes unless what is in the quotes is a title. So in the example given by the original poster, I would write "Jaws". Not "Jaws." In a quoted sentence, though, I would put the punctuation inside the quotes. For example: "I sell seashells," Sally said. "By the seashore."

To me, with my British schooling, that looks as wrong as mine will look to you.

I'd write: 'I sell seashells', Sally said. 'By the seashore'.

The point is that neither is wrong - it just depends where you live and how you were taught.

All editors will look for in a quiz is consistency, so all American or all British with punctuation and spelling.

I'm Canadian, and tend to use a mix of British and American styles. Not so much with punctuation - we were taught mostly American - but with spelling, you bet. This means I don't even enforce consistency beyond the strikingly obvious - it all looks right to me.

This does reinforce something the editors have been saying in the threads about Correction Notes, though - just because you have submitted a CN, doesn't mean the editors will agree with you and make the change.

For some things, right is right, and everything else is wrong. For many others, there's a lot of room for difference.

On FunTrivia we allow authors to put punctuation inside or outside of quotation marks, as long as they are consistent throughout the quiz. The exception is where quotation marks are being used to denote a title, which is a FunTrivia convention to replace italics, which the quizzes are unable to display. The editors agreed a while back that punctuation that is not part of the title would be placed outside of the quotation marks, regardless of the style the author has decided upon for punctuation in sentences containing actual quotations/dialogue. This is not usually something I'd send a quiz back to the author to fix, however. I'd just quickly fix the punctuation to conform to the FunTrivia convention and place the quiz online, if there were no other errors.

I was taught, and taught, that the punctuation went inside the quotation marks if that was the sentence that was spoken.
In the above example, the sentence heard was - I sell seashells by the seashore.

Sally said, "I sell seashells by the seashore."
"I sell seashells by the seashore," Sally said.
"I sell seashells," Sally said, "by the seashore."
Because the last one is a split quotation, no capitalization on the final phrase. Is that how you do it?

I read "War and Peace". The period is outside because it isn't part of the book title mentioned. Is that how you do that one?

We would have the period outside, for "War and Peace" because it is a title, and the period is not part of the title.

For the sentences about Sally, either inside the quotation marks or outside would be allowed, as both are correct. There would be no capitalization on the final phrase.

Because FT quizzes are built on questions, this situation comes up quite frequently.
Who was the author of the book "War and Peace?" I see the question mark inside the quotation marks when it is not part of the title.
I think you are promoting this format. Who was the author of the book "War and Peace"?

But then I've seen these from time to time.
Who was the author of the book "War and Peace."?
Who was the author of the book "War and Peace?"?
Who was the author of the book "War and Peace?".

Do you want CNs on those?

I was taught that the punctuation went outside the quotation marks, which is standard British usage. The quotation is 'I sell seashells by the seashore' (end of quotation), so then add the comma before Sally said: 'I sell seashells by the seashore', Sally said. I also use single quotation marks, not double, as you can see.

As an author, that's the style I'd use because it's natural. As an editor, I know to accept either format, so use the version that you've brought up to use.

From the article trident linked -

While I would correct the first entry to the second one in a new quiz I was editing, I would not bother sending a correction on an old quiz.



Yes on all three of those, because neither of the periods belongs, and only a single question mark is appropriate. (Note that if the title were "Who's There?", it would be appropriate to have double punctuation, one question mark for the actual title, one for the question: Who was the author of the book "Who's There?"? - it may look strange to my eyes, but can be justified.)

Punctuation is one of the areas where all of us were taught the correct usage, but there are a number of different styles. Another example is the use of commas in a list. I was taught to have a comma after each one (red, white, and blue) but when I moved to Australia I was told definitively that the commas are replacing the word and, so the final one should absolutely not be there (red, white and blue). Each one is right in the right place, and here we are happy to accept either. Sometimes you will see things you think look wrong, but there are other people who see them as fine, and find others looking incorrect which are perfectly correct in your eyes.

Language actually has fewer hard and fast rules than we are taught in school.

That looks strange to my eyes too...



I was always told if a list has at least three (using your example or red, white, and blue) has a comma before the "and". I was also taught during high school (which was 20 years ago for me) that punctuation always was enclosed within the quotation marks, but now I see that both usages are accepted in schools in the US.

Dave brings up another aspect.

Language is a living thing, and the rules some of us were taught fifty or more years ago may not be true anymore. Certain things become accepted usage, and it's not our job as editors to fight a rearguard action to preserve punctuation practices simply because they are what we were taught, if the language has moved on.

I am.

I was also taught that punctuation should be outside the quotation marks when referring to a title, mainly because said punctuation is not part of the title. Calling the book 'War and Peace?' would make it more of a mystery...and it would be incorrect.

As LT already said, I would typically correct this myself if the quiz came through the queue.

So if I were to ask for Edward Albee, i could ask the following question.

Who wrote "Who's Afraid of Virginia Woolf?"?

I might try to come up with another question, for this spelling leaves me quite astonished.

Exactly. That's the way I've always done it.

Someone brought up in the British quotes system might also look at that twice and in some cases, if the sentence looks odd or clumsy, they would rephrase it to avoid any problems.

Thus, 'Who wrote "Who's Afraid of Virginia Woolf?"?' might become 'Who's Afraid of Virginia Wolfe? is a well-known play; who wrote it?'

These things don't happen often but the idea of putting the punctuation for the sentence as a whole inside a quote, which is only part of that sentence, doesn't make sense to us at all - it leaves the sentence dangling and unfinished and, as Kyle said, it can alter the meaning of the quote, which adds literary insult to grammatical injury!

No, because then 'Who's Afraid of Virginia Wolfe? is a well-known play; who wrote it?' appears to be the title.

See, this is what happens when you think about punctuation too much! I meant to write:

'Who wrote "Who's Afraid of Virginia Woolf?"?' might become '"Who's Afraid of Virginia Wolfe?" is a well-known play; who wrote it?'

oops.

Are you putting single quotation marks on the entire sentence because you are quoting the previous post? It adds an extra element of confusion to this, doesn't it? All you need is the quotation marks on the book title.
"Who's Afraid of Virginia Wolfe?" is a well-known play; who wrote it?

I was originally quoting someone else and they were quoting the book... I was brought up to use both forms of marks if two sets were required - in this case I used single marks as my quotation from that person and double marks for their quotation of the book to show which marks belonged to each other. I had to extend the quote when I suggested an alternative phrasing. But no big deal, the original question was answered days ago.

Will the new database Terry has installed allow Who's Afraid of Virginia Wolfe? or Who's Afraid of Virginia Wolfe??

Not likely, since the quiz side of the site does not allow HTML in quizzes, and has been that way for several years.