#212867 - Fri Feb 13 2004 01:31 PM
Math vs maths (and other differences)
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Star Poster
Registered: Thu Sep 30 1999
Posts: 11250
Loc: Munchkinland
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I didn't know where to put this thread, so I'm putting it here.
There are some terms that I'm seeing the threads that I'm thinking are (yet another!) cultural thing.
For instance, when some of you are talking about your arithmetic classes, you say "Maths class." I'd never heard this before. We've always called it "Math class" (without the "s"). Is this how it's called in other places? If so, where are you from (want to get an idea of who uses it)?
There are some other terms, too. For instance, I've always said "graduate from high school" but it looks like some of you say "graduate high school."
There isn't a right or wrong answer here! We're all right. But, it's interesting to me that there are these slight cultural differences.
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#212868 - Fri Feb 13 2004 01:35 PM
Re: Math vs maths (and other differences)
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Administrator
Registered: Sun Dec 19 1999
Posts: 38005
Loc: Jersey Channel Islands
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OK sweetie, we will give you another English lesson! Maths is short for mathematics, that is plural so the abbreivation is plural also - well that is what we do in England.  Also in the UK we don't graduate from high school, we only graduate from university.
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#212869 - Fri Feb 13 2004 02:04 PM
Re: Math vs maths (and other differences)
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Star Poster
Registered: Thu Sep 30 1999
Posts: 11250
Loc: Munchkinland
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Hmmmmm....interesting!  And, actually, that brings up another point! We would say "graduate from college." "Graduate from university" really isn't a phrase I hear much.
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#212871 - Fri Feb 13 2004 02:22 PM
Re: Math vs maths (and other differences)
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Star Poster
Registered: Thu Sep 30 1999
Posts: 11250
Loc: Munchkinland
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We use "university" but not like it appears you do. But, this "maths" thing has me intrigued! I kept thinking y'all were just making typos. But, then I noticed that it wasn't just one person, so I thought I'd better ask what the heck was going on!
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#212872 - Fri Feb 13 2004 02:28 PM
Re: Math vs maths (and other differences)
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Moderator
Registered: Tue May 15 2001
Posts: 14384
Loc: Australia
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So, how do you use University? Where would someone go to become a doctor in the US?
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#212873 - Fri Feb 13 2004 02:37 PM
Re: Math vs maths (and other differences)
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Star Poster
Registered: Thu Sep 30 1999
Posts: 11250
Loc: Munchkinland
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They'd get their Bachelor's degree at the University of (whatever) or Such and Such University. And, then they'd go to medical school.
But, I went to college (I didn't go to university).
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#212874 - Fri Feb 13 2004 02:39 PM
Re: Math vs maths (and other differences)
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Explorer
Registered: Wed Mar 12 2003
Posts: 96
Loc: New York City New York USA
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One would get a four -year college degree, then three years of medical school; or one could have fun in college, and attend med school in Grenada..
I myself have a degree from City University of New York, Hunter College.
Edited by rootsgrrl (Fri Feb 13 2004 02:41 PM)
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#212875 - Fri Feb 13 2004 02:49 PM
Re: Math vs maths (and other differences)
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Multiloquent
Registered: Mon Dec 06 1999
Posts: 2742
Loc: Wyoming USA Way Out West
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The term "maths" isn't used in the U.S. We have math classes, but not maths classes. Maths presupposes more than one study of math, so if you are taking algebra and trigonometry at the same time I suppose that 'maths' is appropriate. We do not 'graduate high school.' We graduate FROM high school. The former expression indicates that the school graduated you instead of you graduating from it.
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#212876 - Fri Feb 13 2004 02:52 PM
Re: Math vs maths (and other differences)
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Star Poster
Registered: Thu Sep 30 1999
Posts: 11250
Loc: Munchkinland
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Quote:
so if you are taking algebra and trigonometry at the same time I suppose that 'maths' is appropriate.
Technically, I guess that might be the case. But, I'd still say "math class" or I'd just say which one I was talking about "algrebra" or "trig".
I'd never heard "maths" until I came here.
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#212877 - Fri Feb 13 2004 03:27 PM
Re: Math vs maths (and other differences)
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Multiloquent
Registered: Wed Nov 12 2003
Posts: 2165
Loc: Nebraska USA
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University is so called because it teaches more than one discipline. (It is universal.) Within most universities are various colleges. The Teacher's College, Business College, the College of Arts and Sciences. In the case of graduating from a university, you would also probably be graduating from a college, and generally during graduation ceremonies, this is indicated. Colleges tend to usually focus on one set of dsciplines, as a liberal arts college, or a tech college. I don't really know how the so-called "community colleges" we have in the states fall into those definitions. But in any case, "college" and "university" are often used interchangably, but that isn't exactly accurate.
I've never heard of "maths" class. "Mathematics" isn't any more plural than "physics" and therefore pluraling the abbreviation doesn't really make sense to me. The terms refer to the study of certain disciplines. Mathematics can also be used to describe a group of related subjects, but in general is used in its non-plural form. You wouldn't call Algebra "a" mathematic, because "mathematic" is not the singular form of mathematics. However, you would call it mathematic, because that is the adjective which means of or relating to mathematics.
Not that I'm saying anyone is wrong, just that the "plural" reasoning doesn't exactly follow to me. But then, I'm American, so what do I know about the English language.
Edited by Lothruin (Fri Feb 13 2004 03:29 PM)
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#212878 - Fri Feb 13 2004 03:32 PM
Re: Math vs maths (and other differences)
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Registered: Wed Oct 17 2001
Posts: 8479
Loc: Hastings Sussex England UK
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As a Brit, I’ve always said “maths.” I think the first time I heard “math” was in my late teens when I heard Tom Lehrer’s song “My Home Town” (“the guy that taught us math, who never took a bath ….”). Even then I thought that Lehrer was probably taking a liberty with the word “maths” for the sake of the rhyme: it wasn’t till much later that I realized that “math” was normal US usage.
Most of the “tertiary level” institutions in England are now officially universities, and we usually speak of “going to university” or “graduating from university,” Even so, we might occasionally use the word “college” even in speaking of a university.
What occasionally throws me is when I hear Americans using the simple word “school” of an institution which seems to be a pretty prestigious university. I seem to hear things like “I was at school with him at Yale.” Is it usual in the States to call a university a “school,” or am I imagining things?
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#212879 - Fri Feb 13 2004 03:44 PM
Re: Math vs maths (and other differences)
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Star Poster
Registered: Thu Sep 30 1999
Posts: 11250
Loc: Munchkinland
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No, that would be normal usage, TT.
I went to school with someone named Janet (and we were in college at the time).
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#212880 - Fri Feb 13 2004 05:09 PM
Re: Math vs maths (and other differences)
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Administrator
Registered: Sat Mar 29 2003
Posts: 16595
Loc: Western Canada
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As a Canadian, I think I can weigh in here. We follow American usage when it comes to "Math", but British when it comes to "College". We don't say "going away to college", "met him at college", etc, unless it really is a college, that is a "community college", a tech school. We would say "University", or "school". (Oh, wait, "school" in this case is American - oh, well, that's the Canadian way, picking and choosing our way through life, taking the best of all worlds. We get to spell words any way we want, too)
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#212881 - Fri Feb 13 2004 09:16 PM
Re: Math vs maths (and other differences)
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Forum Champion
Registered: Thu Feb 17 2000
Posts: 8089
Loc: Kingsbury London UK
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College is actually an incredibly vague term in the UK, as it is used as a generic term for any place of learning, so private secondary schools and professional institutes use it equally, and in fact, apart from Universities that are divided into smaller colleges like Oxford and Cambridge, they generally are the only places that don't use it. Because they're universities. Colleges of Higher education are the official colleges that award degrees, and are somehow seen as lower as they are usually easier to get into, though technically all first degrees are equal by law (Education act).
The old polytechnics (now universities) were another anomaly possibly unique to British historic rather than planned progress, and as the word was so long, it was either referred to as poly or college in speech, though college wasn't strictly applicable. I was (in the minority I think) pleased to see the demise of the polytechnic (and not just because I went to one, it happened long after I left) as too many people thought our degrees couldn't be as good. I wish I could send all of them individually to try a day of my law lectures, and then see if they thought that. They were easier to get into, granted, but very hard to stay in. Anyone who wasn't up to it soon vanished and by the 3rd year only the capable students were left. Our recent policies here mean it's more likely such students will now survive in universities as the government wants so many people to have degrees. I propose a BA in trivia studies myself. And put myself up to be professor.
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#212882 - Sat Feb 14 2004 03:20 AM
Re: Math vs maths (and other differences)
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Moderator
Registered: Mon Dec 03 2001
Posts: 20912
Loc: Sydney NSW Australia
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I would like to post on 'another difference', ie, the method of writing and voicing numbers over one hundred. An example woud be 123.
In Australia, we would say "One hundred and twenty three", but I have heard (and read) Americans say "One hundred twenty three".
To put in on a quiz type basis, if the question was "In which number is the letter 'A' first used, when spelled out?". My answer would be 101 (one hundred and one, but how many countries would say '1,000' (one thousand)?
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#212883 - Sat Feb 14 2004 06:54 AM
Re: Math vs maths (and other differences)
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Administrator
Registered: Sun Dec 19 1999
Posts: 38005
Loc: Jersey Channel Islands
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You have mentioned that people in the US go to law school or medical school, in Britain these are just departments (faculties) within a university. Both my daughter and her partner went to the same university, she was in the law department, he was in the medical school. Both graduated with degrees from XYZ University, as did people with degrees of all sorts, they just wore different coloured hoods at graduation. My daughter has remained at the same university and is working towards either an MPhil or a PhD (depends when she runs out of money), we don't say she is at grad school.
In conversation we would definitely say that our children are 'at uni', not at college.
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#212884 - Sat Feb 14 2004 08:12 AM
Re: Math vs maths (and other differences)
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Moderator
Registered: Thu Sep 30 1999
Posts: 12593
Loc: Kowloon Tong Hong Kong
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There are several other phrases only applied to Education in England. We don't usually go 'to' university, we are 'up' at Oxford or Cambridge, and we come 'down' for the vac.We 'read 'law or languages, arts etc., and we take 'Little Go', which is the mid course examinations. Of course 'Great Go' is the finals.There are many other different references. I had certainly never heard of reading anything called 'Math'. But as someone said, it takes all sorts....
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#212885 - Sat Feb 14 2004 12:32 PM
Re: Math vs maths (and other differences)
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Multiloquent
Registered: Wed Nov 12 2003
Posts: 2165
Loc: Nebraska USA
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Generally, in the US we would always say a person was away at college or at school, and "university" is only used in that circumstance if we are actually calling the school by name, as in the University of Nebraska.
School is really a very generic term used to describe any place someone learns. Elementary, middle and high schools, colleges and universities are schools, and even the school of hair design. If you were to tell someone your child was away at school, it would generally be assumed they were at college, because younger children aren't as likely to be "away" at elementary school. If they aren't at college, then there would be something more specific added, like military school or boarding school.
College is never used to describe anything but an institution of "higher learning." No high schools or lower are ever called colleges, although some high schools are affiliated with colleges or universities and are called "prep" schools, short for preparatory. (Preparing for college.) For instance, there is a school in Omaha called "Creighton University" and there is also a high school called "Creighton Prep."
We don't have any little or great go's, we just have mid-terms and finals. We aren't up at college unless it is north of us, or down for vacation unless we've gone south. At least, not in Nebraska. Generally, if something is north of you, it is referred to as up, and south is down. The only time that isn't the case is if the thing is directly east or west, not northerly or southerly in any way, or if it is within the same municipality as you, and then it is just over. My old stuffed animals are over at my parents' house. My dad is down in Cancun, my sister down at Emory University in Atlanta. My boss's son goes to school up at Midlands College. There is no prestige value placed on whether a thing is up or down.
I've never heard of reading math either, we take math. If we are actively taking math we might be working math, but never reading math.
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#212887 - Sat Feb 14 2004 05:45 PM
Re: Math vs maths (and other differences)
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Administrator
Registered: Sun Dec 19 1999
Posts: 38005
Loc: Jersey Channel Islands
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To take TT's post a little further, if we say that someone is 'away at school' it would mean that they were at a public/boarding school but we wouldn't add that, it would be taken for granted and besides which it would be the done thing to add it. We don't say 'my son is at public school', we just say that he is away at school, or we might say the name of the school.
Prep is also homework or in the case of those away at school, work done after classes finish.
What has become a little confusing in recent years is that girls can now attend public schools, it always used to be that only boys went to public schools, the girls went to boarding school. Now some what had previously been boys only schools have become co-educational either entirely or for the sixth form. To be a public school, the headmaster must have been admitted to the Headmasters' Conference.
Edited by sue943 (Sat Feb 14 2004 05:49 PM)
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#212888 - Fri Feb 20 2004 12:16 PM
Re: Math vs maths (and other differences)
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Star Poster
Registered: Thu Sep 30 1999
Posts: 11250
Loc: Munchkinland
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Looks like we have another difference!
RE: the "bathroom" "restroom" "wc" "washroom" issue in another thread....
We call it bathroom or restroom. It tends to be a more polite term to use restroom when talking about it - at least, where I am.
(And, before someone asks, yes, it's called a bathroom even if there's no bathtub in it.)
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#212889 - Fri Feb 20 2004 12:31 PM
Re: Math vs maths (and other differences)
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Forum Champion
Registered: Sun Jun 16 2002
Posts: 5337
Loc: Nijmegen/Brisbane
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So if I were in the USA and needed to go very badly, how would I ask for the location of the bathroom/restroom/toilet/whatever without using a terribly impolite synonym? And what would I say in the UK, Canada or Australia? Darn, why didn't they teach me that in school!
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#212890 - Fri Feb 20 2004 12:34 PM
Re: Math vs maths (and other differences)
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Star Poster
Registered: Thu Sep 30 1999
Posts: 11250
Loc: Munchkinland
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You could use either restroom or bathroom. This isn't written in stone, but I think I'd tend to use either when in someone's home. In a public place, I think I'd use restroom over the other. If you asked for a "wc" no one would know what you wanted. And, if you needed to go that badly, you wouldn't want to waste time trying to explain a term that's not used here!  You could use "toilet" but it's a bit more (this isn't the word I want, but it'll do) vulgar sounding. I wouldn't use it; it just doesn't sound as polite.
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