Subject: Ann Coulter Gagged
Posted by: Cymruambyth
Date: Mar 24 10
The Queen of Mean got her come-uppance in Ottawa yesterday when a scheduled speaking engagement by the darling of the right was cancelled, by the Royal Canadian Mounted Police, no less.
Mighty Mouth was booked to speak to students at the University of Ottawa but after making demeaning comments to a student at another university the day before, thousands of people protested outside the University. The RCMP stepped in and cancelled the event in the interests of protecting Ms Coulter's safety.
Nobody, evidently, has ever told Ms Coulter that she can't be a demagogue and she's very upset.
Frankly, I'd have let her make her speech. I believe that Canadians - especially Canadian university students - are smart enough to listen to her fustian without experiencing mind-melt.
Be that as it may, Ms C. is now aware of Canadian hate speech laws and that you can't say just what you like in Canada if it demeans or incites hatred against any person or group. She seems to believe that we don't have free speech here. She mistakes the matter. We have free speech. We don't have the freedom to preach hatred or white supremacy!
Posted by: Cymruambyth
Date: Mar 24 10
The Queen of Mean got her come-uppance in Ottawa yesterday when a scheduled speaking engagement by the darling of the right was cancelled, by the Royal Canadian Mounted Police, no less.
Mighty Mouth was booked to speak to students at the University of Ottawa but after making demeaning comments to a student at another university the day before, thousands of people protested outside the University. The RCMP stepped in and cancelled the event in the interests of protecting Ms Coulter's safety.
Nobody, evidently, has ever told Ms Coulter that she can't be a demagogue and she's very upset.
Frankly, I'd have let her make her speech. I believe that Canadians - especially Canadian university students - are smart enough to listen to her fustian without experiencing mind-melt.
Be that as it may, Ms C. is now aware of Canadian hate speech laws and that you can't say just what you like in Canada if it demeans or incites hatred against any person or group. She seems to believe that we don't have free speech here. She mistakes the matter. We have free speech. We don't have the freedom to preach hatred or white supremacy!
88 replies. On page 1 of 5 pages. 1 2 3 4 5
guitargoddess 
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I posted about this in the Forums, along with links to articles with some quotes. Evidently the University of Ottawa is "bushleague" and "worse than even the stupidest universities in the States" (or something to that effect). I'm on the fence about whether she should have been allowed to speak or not. I think that people there (and it wasn't just students) could have handled it professionally and intelligently, but I also kind of think that she shouldn't have been invited to speak in the first place. I do believe that controversial issues and speakers have their place, especially in universities, and that challenging these opinions and offering your own are part of academia, but it needs to be done in a respectful manner (on the part of both sides of every issue). Ann Coulter can have whatever opinions she wants, but she does not seem to be able to intelligently back up her opinions. I'd have no issue with a very right-wing person coming to give a talk on something (the example I used over in the Forums was the war on Iraq, something I've seen Coulter defending). I'll probably disagree with them, but as long as they say it respectfully and intelligently, they can give whatever speech they like. Knowing that that's not what Coulter is like, perhaps she shouldn't have been scheduled to speak in the first place. There is no room for inflammatory remarks and personal attacks in what is supposed to be an educational, political talk. Reply #1. Mar 24 10, 2:19 PM |
daver852
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"Anyone, who by his thoughts or actions - yes, his thoughts - encroaches on the unity of the socialist state we will destroy." - Joseph Stalin, 1935 "We can never be sure that the opinion we are endeavoring to stifle is a false opinion; and even if we were sure, stifling it would be an evil still." - John Stuart Mill "On Liberty" Reply #2. Mar 24 10, 4:00 PM |
REDVIKING57
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"Can you point me in the direction of Poland?" - Adolf Hitler,1939. "What's that smoke over there?" - Commander 327th. Rifle Division,Soviet Red Army,Auschwitz,1945. See the "Land of Milk and Honey" that extremists,left or right,lead us to? Reply #3. Mar 25 10, 7:59 AM |
poneke
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"People demand freedom of speech as a compensation for the freedom of thought which they seldom use." Soren Kierkegaard Reply #4. Mar 25 10, 3:03 PM |
| daver852
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"If we don't believe in freedom of speech for those we despise, we don't believe in it all." - Noam Chomsky "I look upon those who would deny others the right to urge and argue their position, however irksome and pernicious they may seem, as intellectual and moral cowards." - William E. Borah Reply #5. Mar 25 10, 3:28 PM |
Schoonie101
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Chomsky has obviously never worked security at a Raiders or Dodgers game... Reply #6. Mar 25 10, 3:40 PM |
Lochalsh
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"I've known Noam Chomsky, and believe me, daver, you're no Noam Chomsky." --Lochalsh, channeling Lloyd Bentsen ____________ Could we soft-pedal this offering of quotes without comment? I can read well-known authors on my own, but I can't then replicate the immediacy I feel when I read your takes on them. Thanks. Reply #7. Mar 25 10, 3:42 PM |
| guitargoddess
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Besides, no one is saying that Ann Coulter has no right to state her opinions, the point is if she's going to state her opinions, she should do so in an intelligent and respectful way. Not just run her mouth, and then come out with complete racist/homophobic/whatever states and personal attacks when questioned or challenged. That's exactly what the provost of the University of Ottawa was talking about when he sent Coulter an e-mail a couple of days before her scheduled talk, to tell her that, in Canada, freedom of speech doesn't mean you can say whatever you darn well please without consequence. It means you are entitled to express your opinions *without violating the rights and freedoms of anyone else*. Reply #8. Mar 25 10, 6:58 PM |
| Lochalsh
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It means being mannerly, if nothing else. Reply #9. Mar 25 10, 7:24 PM |
| Schoonie101
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Exactly gg but like I said in another thread, anyone has the right to run their mouth and state their opinions but they also have to recognize that they might get their butt kicked as a result. Think of a Denver Broncos fan mouthing off in the Black Hole (or worse, one of the public restrooms) at the Oakland Coliseum. People get coddled and think they can say anything without repercussions when in fact, the world does not work that way. Reply #10. Mar 25 10, 7:25 PM |
| Lochalsh
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Well, I guess I don't sound like a child of the 60s when I use the word "mannerly." Things don't always get done if you're afraid of stepping on toes. What I meant is that one needs to remember that one is a guest, especially when he or she is visiting another country and serving as some sort of representative of one's own. Reply #11. Mar 25 10, 7:27 PM |
| guitargoddess
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"Stepping on toes" is one thing. Having controversial opinions is one thing. But there is absolutely NO place, in my opinion, whether it's in Canada, the US, or anywhere else, for statements of hatred and bigotry. Lumping every Muslim in the world into one category of 'terrorist' and 'not allowed on airplanes' is absolutely not okay. Telling these Muslims that they can ride their flying carpets instead is even MORE not okay. There is absolutely no logical, intelligent basis to that statement, all it is is racist. Reply #12. Mar 25 10, 7:37 PM |
| Schoonie101
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So agreed with that, gg. That's the kind of racist hate-speech that I despise. I have more than a few Muslim friends and they are definitely NOT terrorists! Yeah, you have nutball extremists but so does every religion. The lumping in like that upsets me. Not every Muslim is Bin Laden just like not every Christian is David Koresh or Warren Jeffs. Reply #13. Mar 25 10, 7:49 PM |
| daver852
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I simply cannot believe that people with pretensions of being civilized are defending censorship and mob action action preventing a woman from speaking in a public forum. People can talk as long as they don't engage in "hate speech." As long as they are "mannerly." One would think this was 1984 instead of 2010. As I've always said, scratch a liberal, and underneath that smug veneer of condescending "let's save the world and help the children" messiahnism you'll find the makings of a first-class fascist. Reply #14. Mar 25 10, 11:17 PM |
| Lochalsh
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Or maybe you'll find a heart full of compassion. Reply #15. Mar 25 10, 11:32 PM |
romeomikegolf
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daver, perhaps you should turn your attentions to censorship in your own country before attacking others. http://scholar.lib.vt.edu/ejournals/ALAN/winter96/pubCONN.html Reply #16. Mar 25 10, 11:46 PM |
strudi74
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Freedom of speech is well and good if you have a measure of responsibility in what you have to say. If not, it would be OK for a person to incite violence against other people and groups, then if someone does get attacked to say "I was just exercising my constitutional right". We have a perfect example in South Africa at the moment where a youth league president keeps making racist and inciting remarks and he keeps getting away with it. In the meantime his words are stirring up emotions and inciting murder against other groups- if this is what "freedom of speech" leads to.... I'm all for having your say but you absolutely should get censured if your words or actions violate the rights of others. Reply #17. Mar 26 10, 12:09 AM |
| Schoonie101
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strudi says it far more tactfully than I ever could. But still, daver, why don't you take a little trip to South Side Chicago and exercise your free speech by standing on a street corner and shouting N-Bombs at every person walking by with no police protection. It's not far from you so you have no excuse - put your money where your mouth is and get it on youtube for all of our entertainment. See what happens no matter how much you cry about your rights for free speech. I have a feeling you are either just trolling for responses or are -VERY- sheltered in your life and location. But you served in the military so that shouldn't be an excuse. I am betting you didn't talk too much racist inflammatory stuff back then as YOU were the minority or you would have gotten fragged a LONG time ago. You actually have the audacity to cry "1984"? That's so pathetic, I'm dying of laughter. It's not about liberal or conservatism - it's about reality. Reply #18. Mar 26 10, 12:31 AM |
| Schoonie101
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BTW, Daver, how do you feel about the Westboro Baptist Church protesting the funerals of our fallen soldiers claiming that they are being killed because of the affront to God of the US support of homosexuality or some such? Don't lie. Reply #19. Mar 26 10, 12:35 AM |
channe
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Good grief, it never stops does it? I have no idea where the Westboro Church is, but I intend to find out so I can never find myself there. So much inhumanity and oppression of others because they are different. Different colour, different religion, different sexual preferences, different way of speaking, etc. etc. History is supposed to teach us not to repeat the wrongs of the past but it has failed. Reply #20. Mar 26 10, 2:22 AM |
88 replies. On page 1 of 5 pages. 1 2 3 4 5
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