Subject: Copyright Help For Photos
Posted by: misdiaslocos
Date: Mar 05 24
Hello All,
If these questions have been handled on another area of the site, please forgive me, point me in the right direction, and post a link. I think I have done my due diligence, but I don't want to screw up.
1) I am Canadian, and copyright laws mean that the rights an artist has to their work expires 50 years after death. The US seems to be 70 years, the Japanese law is far more complicated, but I am sure I am in compliance with the laws here. So, given that, can I assume that it is OK to upload a Mark Rothko painting given that the estate lost its rights to the works in 2021?
2) If I grab a photo off a site that does not explicitly indicate that the material is copyrighted, is that allowed?
An example - If I find a blog where some guy has taken a photo of a Rothko painting and he does not identify it a copyright material, can I use that photo?
I know I am bouncing laws here, but according to the Copyright Office of the USA:
To register a website or website content, you must identify the copyrightable authorship you will submit for registration. Copyrightable authorship is original expression contributed by an author that contains at least a minimum amount of creativity.
That last sentence seems instructive as a straight photo of a piece of art would not seem to meet the standards of "original expression contributed by an author that contains at least a minimum amount of creativity". However, I am aware that if there are other elements in the photo (people looking at it, a colored wall behind it...) that it can come under the copyright law.
3) Here is a link to a photo I want to use. I would appreciate any and all input on it.
https://geroasrothko.files.wordpress.com/2011/07/seagram-1-87-large.jpg
Once again, I hope that I am not going over well-trod turf.
Jonathan
Posted by: misdiaslocos
Date: Mar 05 24
Hello All,
If these questions have been handled on another area of the site, please forgive me, point me in the right direction, and post a link. I think I have done my due diligence, but I don't want to screw up.
1) I am Canadian, and copyright laws mean that the rights an artist has to their work expires 50 years after death. The US seems to be 70 years, the Japanese law is far more complicated, but I am sure I am in compliance with the laws here. So, given that, can I assume that it is OK to upload a Mark Rothko painting given that the estate lost its rights to the works in 2021?
2) If I grab a photo off a site that does not explicitly indicate that the material is copyrighted, is that allowed?
An example - If I find a blog where some guy has taken a photo of a Rothko painting and he does not identify it a copyright material, can I use that photo?
I know I am bouncing laws here, but according to the Copyright Office of the USA:
To register a website or website content, you must identify the copyrightable authorship you will submit for registration. Copyrightable authorship is original expression contributed by an author that contains at least a minimum amount of creativity.
That last sentence seems instructive as a straight photo of a piece of art would not seem to meet the standards of "original expression contributed by an author that contains at least a minimum amount of creativity". However, I am aware that if there are other elements in the photo (people looking at it, a colored wall behind it...) that it can come under the copyright law.
3) Here is a link to a photo I want to use. I would appreciate any and all input on it.
https://geroasrothko.files.wordpress.com/2011/07/seagram-1-87-large.jpgOnce again, I hope that I am not going over well-trod turf.
Jonathan
17 replies. On page 1 of 1 pages. 1
LadyNym 
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I am not an editor, but have written enough Photo quizzes to be able to offer you some advice. In my quizzes, I avoid using any photos of artwork by contemporary artists because of the complexity of copyright issues (as you have rightly pointed out in your original post). The few photos of works by Rothko on Wikipedia (which is very careful about using the correct attribution) are marked as "Fair Use" - which is not the same as Public Domain. In addition, I would avoid getting photos from any other site than Wikipedia Commons, Flickr, or Pixabay. I can tell you that I've occasionally had to scrap a question - or even an idea for a whole quiz - because of the unavailability of usable photos. I know it's frustrating, but that's the way it is. Reply #1. Mar 05 24, 6:13 AM |
WesleyCrusher
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Rothko's works are not in the public domain just yet. He died 1970, so the copyright terms are not yet over per US law (which is what FunTrivia is bound by). The Rothko estate case does not pertain to copyright at all - it was about ownership of the physical paintings. Also, with regard to photographs of paintings - those are individually copyrighted if the photo is not only a direct reproduction of the painting itself. As soon as the photo includes any part of the presentation (gallery wall, even the frame if the painting was not framed by the artist himself), it's not just a reproduction. So - sorry, you'll have to wait until 2040 to write your Rothko master quiz. Reply #2. Mar 05 24, 7:29 AM |
misdiaslocos
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Ms Nym, Thank you, and I realized after I sent the post that the rule for copyright runs out 70 years after the death of the artist in most European states and also the USA. Last month I won “The Old Guitarist” by Picasso. Problem is, Picasso died in 1973 meaning that the copyright will not run out until 2043 in the USA. Do you know how this is OK for us to use if it is still under copyright? Thanks again J Reply #3. Mar 05 24, 7:33 AM |
| misdiaslocos
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Wesley. Thanks, but it brings me back to the question of how it is legal for us to use a Picasso when he died three years AFTER Rothko did. Thanks again. J Reply #4. Mar 05 24, 7:36 AM |
| LadyNym
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I would not use any Picasso works either (and they would have been perfect for both my most recent art quizzes) because of the difference in copyright laws in different countries. Just a look at the Wikipedia Commons page for "The Old Guitarist" would be enough to dissuade me: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:Old_guitarist_chicago.jpg Reply #5. Mar 05 24, 9:26 AM |
| WesleyCrusher
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The answer as to why the picture could be used is on the Wiki page: The work was created and published outside the US before 1929. It thus has no US copyright. Rothko, on the other hand, worked in the US. Reply #6. Mar 05 24, 1:12 PM |
| WesleyCrusher
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And to make the confusion complete: A US author writing a quiz on early Picasso works using only US-based sites to take pictures from would not violate copyright. Any author OUTSIDE the US where copyright is more than life + 50 years, however, would do so while creating the quiz. (Which means - we probably won't allow a Picasso photo quiz. But for the author gallery, it was doable.) Reply #7. Mar 05 24, 4:01 PM |
BigTriviaDawg
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I'm working on a photo quiz. Does anyone know if this license is acceptable? This is the first time I have come across this one. Thanks! CC0 1.0 Deed link https://creativecommons.org/publicdomain/zero/1.0/Reply #8. Mar 05 24, 5:55 PM |
trident
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It is a public domain license, which means you can use it for anything! You're good to go on this one! Reply #9. Mar 05 24, 7:09 PM |
| BigTriviaDawg
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Awesome! Thanks! Reply #10. Mar 05 24, 8:06 PM |
| misdiaslocos
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Wesley Well, my head exploded, but I understand. What happens if there is a creator who uses a VPN? Sorry, not a serious question, but what a minefield. Thanks for your help. I’ll go back into hibernation until I can do my Rothko quiz in 2040. J Reply #11. Mar 06 24, 4:21 AM |
| WesleyCrusher
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Copyright is a mess. If it were up to me, I'd have MUCH shorter terms. By far the vast majority of commercial exploitation of songs, movies, games and books is happening in the first few years. A term similar to that on patents (25-30 years from initial publication) would in my opinion easily suffice to protect artists' financial interests and reduce the hassle of dealing with rights in a digital world where sharing is the norm, not the exception. (Imagine if the full arsenal of copyrights were applied to social media... you couldn't even easily quote!) Reply #12. Mar 06 24, 10:31 AM |
| misdiaslocos
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Wes, It seems like things are going that way. In the last year or so, you can’t easily copy and paste song lyrics anymore. Sorry, I have one more question. Wikipedia hosts a page on Rothko which includes one of his last paintings. They claim that the image is used under fair use. Is it possible for FunTrivia authors to use this image and others like it in our quizzes? Thanks for all the time you are giving to these questions. J Reply #13. Mar 08 24, 5:41 AM |
| misdiaslocos
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Link to the image I mentioned above. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:RothkoBlackGray.jpg J Reply #14. Mar 08 24, 5:41 AM |
| LadyNym
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Wes will be able to answer much more accurately, but I believe that we are prevented from using images labeled as "fair use" by FT being a commercial site. Film posters and album covers are also labeled as fair use, and if you look at both Music and Movies quizzes you will see there are none that use either posters or covers. Anyway, if you have a look at this site, you might find some clarification on this topic: https://copyrightalliance.org/faqs/what-is-fair-use/Reply #15. Mar 08 24, 6:18 AM |
| WesleyCrusher
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"Fair use" is not a license / provision we can accept. Wiki can do so because it's documentation / education, but writing a quiz is none of the purposes covered by fair use. Reply #16. Mar 08 24, 4:11 PM |
| misdiaslocos
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FunTrivia - come for the games, stay for the education!! Thanks all! Reply #17. Mar 09 24, 1:24 AM |
17 replies. On page 1 of 1 pages. 1
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