Subject: The pictures on Voyager's Golden Disk
Posted by: havan_ironoak
Date: Apr 15 19
Netflix is currently showing a film called "The Farthest" about the whole Voyager project and they talk quite a bit about the whole "Golden Disk." I understand their putting greetings and songs on it and even their reserving a section for encoded photographs.
But they show the photos that they picked and the first few were actually charts that had been composed by Frank Drake.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Contents_of_the_Voyager_Golden_Record#Images
It seems like it was something of a waste in that the information could have been much more accessible if it hadn't been reduced into some type of encoded picture file.
It's also a bit unclear as to how aliens are supposed to know how to translate these encoded images back into actual images. Does anybody have any info on that?
Posted by: havan_ironoak
Date: Apr 15 19
Netflix is currently showing a film called "The Farthest" about the whole Voyager project and they talk quite a bit about the whole "Golden Disk." I understand their putting greetings and songs on it and even their reserving a section for encoded photographs.
But they show the photos that they picked and the first few were actually charts that had been composed by Frank Drake.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Contents_of_the_Voyager_Golden_Record#ImagesIt seems like it was something of a waste in that the information could have been much more accessible if it hadn't been reduced into some type of encoded picture file.
It's also a bit unclear as to how aliens are supposed to know how to translate these encoded images back into actual images. Does anybody have any info on that?
8 replies. On page 1 of 1 pages. 1
brm50diboll 
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The underlying assumption is that any alien species that might intercept the record at some distant time in the future would necessarily be highly intelligent and familiar with certain universal mathematical and physical constants which could be used in the decoding process. Since it is a phonograph record, by necessity it is analog, but I believe the code is a type of digital code. The implication being that aliens would not necessarily have a decimal-based (powers of ten) mathematical system (as their ancestors might not have ten fingers), but should understand binary mathematics. A phonograph record player was included for the aliens' convenience. Let's just hope they don't see it as food. Everyone understands that, in probability terms, the likelihood that this is intercepted is extremely low, but billions of years is a long time, and it can't hurt. Reply #1. Apr 15 19, 10:02 PM |
havan_ironoak
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I've got no issue with the code being binary but there needs to be an encoding scheme to represent an image no? Have you ever tried to look at a .jpg file in notepad? yes, the underlying file is binary but in notepad all one sees in gibberish and the binary doesn't make it an image it requires a special algorithm. I know that such algorithms can be derived even we dumb earthlings can do that with steganography. But the images that show basic counting and powers and addition and subtraction seem ideal to be included both as image files and as the images themselves. BTW. the images about numbers do have the binary but also make it clear that we use a base 10 number system. Look at the third image in this group https://voyager.jpl.nasa.gov/galleries/images-on-the-golden-record/ Reply #2. Apr 15 19, 10:16 PM |
| havan_ironoak
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It says that "The 115 images are encoded in analog form." I'm just not able to understand what that means. What analog form is used? I'm guessing that it's not ascii text ;-) Reply #3. Apr 15 19, 10:20 PM |
| brm50diboll
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I'll admit I didn't find it on my last Google search. I'd read about this years ago. It's probably buried in the internet somewhere. Just don't have enough time to spend on anymore searching right now. Whatever code was used was something that would've existed in the 70s. So not exactly state of the art. But again, the assumption was that the aliens were intelligent (more intelligent than us). All analog means is that the data comes out sequentially (as the record is played) and is not digitally encoded in a specific region of memory space (as in computer drives). Reply #4. Apr 15 19, 10:56 PM |
| brm50diboll
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They do want the aliens to know early on in the decoding process (assuming all we assume, of course) that we humans use a decimal mathematical system. That will make it easier for them to understand the rest. Think of it this way: if we intercepted a message with mathematical formulae in weird symbols that our experts in mathematical cryptography determined was Base 7, once we ascertained that, it would be easy to convert their Base 7 to our Base 10. Similarly, whatever mathematical system the hypothetical aliens use (and Base 2 is the simplest, so we include some of that), we would hope that once they know we use Base 10, they can just as easily convert our Base 10 into whatever system they use. Reply #5. Apr 16 19, 2:02 AM |
| havan_ironoak
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All your points make sense but I'm still puzzled as to how the analog encoding of images was done. I can understand the need for encoding the more complex images. But the the simple black and white ones that are really just stick figure drawings seem like they should have been etched into the cover of the Golden Record like the astral co-ordinates etc were. If they were etched AND encoded as the first few images it would be a sort of rosetta stone as to the encoding algorithm, no? Reply #6. Apr 16 19, 8:41 PM |
| brm50diboll
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I can't answer that. I'm sure the answer is available somewhere on the internet but I don't have the time to do any more searches. I'm also not a computer coder. I learned a little BASIC and Fortran 30-odd years ago but I'm not competent to explain the methods and reasoning behind what they did to any level of detail beyond what I've already said. Nor would I try to predict hypothetical future alien psychology. A great deal more information could be included with less space with present technology, and, in fact, has been, as the Voyagers were not the only human probes that were designed to leave our solar system. Already, New Horizons (which flew by Pluto a few years ago) is hurtling through the Kuiper belt and will enter interstellar space before too many more years. It might not have a record, but its computer system and instrumentation is far more advanced than anything on Voyager and would tell any hypothetical future aliens a great deal about us. Of course, it's headed out of the solar system in a completely different direction than Voyager. Reply #7. Apr 16 19, 10:04 PM |
WesleyCrusher
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As far as I know, it is just an encoding based on amplitude - white is high amplitude, black is low, although I don't know how they did color (might be frequency). The circle and the first charts are meant as decoding aids. The visual representation of numbers and units is needed to be able to easily superimpose them on the later images - a separate data track would possibly not be perceived as connected to an image and would suffer exactly the JPG problem - what is the encoding? The most critical assumption in the images is that the recipients will be able to decode them into a rectangle of light and project or print them, realizing that they must be done line by line. The circle and the chart with the galaxy are meant to help that idea. Of course all of this relies on the aliens having a means to perceive electromagnetic waves in a spectrum similar to ours. A big if, if you ask me. Reply #8. Apr 17 19, 2:33 AM |
8 replies. On page 1 of 1 pages. 1
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